eswtg
Horror Fiend
Posts: 79
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Post by eswtg on Jun 30, 2008 9:57:59 GMT -5
I watched this last night and have to say I enjoyed it. The premise is very simple one (a small family is terrorised and tortured by two assailants) but its done with an artistry and subtly that made it far more interesting than the recent rash of "torture porn" films. The acting is good and both the anguish of the victims and the sadistic glee of the torturers is conveyed well. The actual torture is also fairly simple without any riddiculously over ellaborate contraptions or set pieces which make the emotions and mental torture all the more realisitic/engaging. The actual gore/violence is limited and only occurs off screen but this adds to the originality and subtlty of the film. The film also uses some original techniques to convey its ideas, the torturers actually converse with the viewers which although many might find annoying or labouring the films moral point of view, I applaude the restrained use of an original idea that could so easily have been done to death within the film. I also really liked the opening title sequences and the nice slightly grindhouse-esque use of music. In summary an fairly intelligent (and in places, original) and refreshingly subtle portrail of the currently popular tortue subject matter. P.S havent seen the original but apparently its a shot for shot replica.
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Coffin Jim
Administrator
What is blood? It is the reason to exist!
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Post by Coffin Jim on Jun 30, 2008 10:04:13 GMT -5
Thanks for the review, eswtg! I'm curious what you'd think of the original. Personally, I don't condone shot-for-shot remakes, like this or Psycho (1998).
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eswtg
Horror Fiend
Posts: 79
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Post by eswtg on Jun 30, 2008 10:15:39 GMT -5
No, I know what you mean its seems a little pointless however I can understand that making it in american will open it up to a much wider audience. Obviously ideally the language shouldnt make a difference but sadly it does. You can argue about it being more important that a film is a directors/writter expression and so shouldn't be about money but these are aspects of life that cant be argued with.
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Post by shaggyrand on Jun 30, 2008 13:47:26 GMT -5
I found both versions to be pretentious, condescending, heavy handed, overtly preachy, puritanical, filled with faux intellectualism, and undermines (and I really don't think Henke realized that he kept doing this) itself time and time again (actually the breaking of the fourth wall was one of the most annoying and smug things it could have done) ... but I'm glad you enjoyed it... just one question...
What originality is there in it... all of it had been done before and better (especially the fourth wall breaking, that seems to have captivated your attention). The way it 'played' with time with the rewind and ect.? Again done so often that it's not funny.
Not original, not interesting... and the subject matter has been done much much better many times before.
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eswtg
Horror Fiend
Posts: 79
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Post by eswtg on Jul 1, 2008 7:24:18 GMT -5
I agree that it could be seen as heavy handed/preachy or smug as the breaking of the fourth wall is unsubtle however I liked the fact it was done and not overly done (I only recall twice). I know It has been done before not least in fight club et al but I thought it did add something to the film. (like wise the rewinding, unsubtle as a technique but not over done in my opinon) I can see where the faux intellectualism comes from but compared to Hostel and Saw I was pleased to see it attempt at some weightier concept even if it was only a small step up. (I know films dont have to be intellectual and hostel/saw can be enertaining in case it seems im bashing "low brow" films) You mention its been done better before? which films would you recommend?
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eswtg
Horror Fiend
Posts: 79
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Post by eswtg on Jul 1, 2008 7:29:37 GMT -5
oh sorry in answer to your orginality question, I found it original due to its mix of qualities. ie well acted, "realistic" torture scenes (not over ellaborate or unrealistic heroism) combined with a touch of higher concepts (agreed not amazingly insightful but still a nod in a good direction) plus the restrained use of more unexpected techniques that although argueably gimicky and preachy they werent over done IMO.
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Post by Matttttttttttt on Jul 1, 2008 8:59:18 GMT -5
I saw this in theaters and was so completely bored by it. If you've seen the original, there is absolutely no need to see this one. It's the same exact movie, but with performances that aren't nearly as good as in Haneke's original movie. I'm tired of hearing directors argue that they're remaking foreign-language films (especially shot-for-shot) so that a different group of people can see it. It's about the damn money. Haneke should cut the bullshit and admit it already. Shot-for-shot remakes save money because you don't have to create an original script and the set design was already there for them to work with.
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Post by shaggyrand on Jul 1, 2008 9:26:18 GMT -5
I You mention its been done better before? which films would you recommend? Off the top of my head movies that had similar themes (so it's probably not the best list I can think of, I'll get back later (probably0 with a better list): If I Die Before I Wake Man Bites Dog Peeping Tom Hard Candy Henry: Portrait of a Serial Killer Straw Dogs La Ceremonie (Damn, Haneke is incredibly lucky that Chabrol has fallen out of art house favor or else Funny Games and the rest of his films would be just more forgotten wastes of film... no really go check this one out... now... right fucking now... no, really...) That's all for now... when I think of something else I'll add it, I know there are tons more. Rivette has done the same concepts incredibly well, but I can't think of the title (I fucking hate that, happens all the damn time... got my memory is fucked)... Hitchcock & Lynch both approached it better as well...
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eswtg
Horror Fiend
Posts: 79
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Post by eswtg on Jul 2, 2008 3:02:53 GMT -5
Having seen a few of those films I think they're signifincantly different to FG. I liked the way it really only focusses on the simplistic torture elements and the emotion/glee of both the victims, assailants and indeed the audience, Its very simplistic really but thats its charm I think. Movies like Man bites dog use a documentary angle which is great but significantly different, Hard candy focusses on the paedo elements and straw dogs is more about home defence and ideas of masculinity, They are all great films but very different beasts to FG. The simplistic and harrowing approach is what I considered original in FG and although I appreciate the issues you've raised it still worked for me on that level, I will def look into Le ceremonie!
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Post by shaggyrand on Jul 3, 2008 9:58:58 GMT -5
What? Please, they explore and examine the same themes. Because the guy in Hard Candy is a pedo, or Man Bites Dog is shot in a verite style doesn't mean that they're that different at all.... 'Harrowing'? Please...
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eswtg
Horror Fiend
Posts: 79
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Post by eswtg on Jul 3, 2008 10:46:44 GMT -5
Neither HC or MBD attempt to step outside the "confines" of what the audience expects from the idea of a film. You can dislike the effect but the fact the haneke even attempted this is what I find original. Allowing the protogonists to be aware that they are in a film and so boldy ignore the normal "rules" is at the very least creative in film making. Making a conscience decision to not give the audience what they want, in order to make a point about the fact they want it in the first place (even if they are unaware they wanted it so badly) is a welcome step away from the many average (conceptually) horror films that everyone complains about, to me this is a brave attempt at using film in a different way, fair enough if you didnt like it but I still think it stands out for its bravery and originality.
In regard to "Harrowing" I personally find the idea of two adolecsecents stabbing and mentally torturing a family more realistic (and for me harrowing) than the idea a 14yr old girl has the abiliity to set and up and so perfectly execute such a encounter with a paedo in HC. MBD is very good and I also found the rape scene harrowing in its simplicity. again its subjective but excessive, over glossy, elaborate torture or murder bends my belief too far and I'm safely reminded its just a film. Brutal, simplistic, unvarnished rape, home invasion, murder etc to be is more realistic and therefore harrowing
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